Without submission, does it work?

Whether we call it "domestic discipline" or "rules" or "structure" or just "getting our needs met." This is a spot for those meta discussions about what it is that we do.

Re: Without submission, does it work?

Postby splorange » Sun May 20, 2012 9:41 am

Yes, agreed. Submission is in you, at any given time. Or for an extended period of time. Submitting is just doing something at the time. So you can submit to a punishment without being submissive. No, without being in submission. Submissive is going to need a third definition!

Nat wrote:
splorange wrote:I feel SO SO BAD for you! Maybe we should all have a cane day in solidarity. I guess, since you say you don't think of yourself as submissive, you agreed to the cane because it would make her happy, and you wanted all the good stuff more than you wanted to be less in pain?

That’s sort of right, I guess. :)

I didn’t actually AGREE to the cane – there wasn’t a decision to make. Liz can discipline me however she thinks is appropriate, within some limits, so when she decided to use the cane I bought them, and submitted to the punishment. (It’s really interesting trying to build a distinction between submission and submitting, btw, but I’m starting to wonder whether it’s a distinction without a difference, useful inside my head but worthless elsewhere.

I see how that works. But if you were to decide that actually you didn't want to be caned and withdrew consent, she'd respect that (I assume!) so I guess if I were in that situation, I would consent to the evil weapon of evil because withdrawing consent would do something to my relationship that I wouldn't think was worthwhile - undermine my chief, or take me out of an optimal submission state. In which case, it was still be my decision, based on weighing up the pros and cons - I can appreciate.

A No cane day sounds great, but will the tops go for it? Eayore, tentative definition of a cane day is going on the bottoms forum :) before any tops read it and get ideas!
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Re: Without submission, does it work?

Postby Louise » Wed May 23, 2012 1:05 am

I have submissive inclinations, though I don't feel that way all the time. I tend to feel more submissive the more dominant my husband is. Being spanked makes me feel more submissive, but he can do it with just a few well chosen words, or sometimes just a look. I was the one who suggested DD to him (very tentatively), but he took to it like a duck to water.

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Re: Without submission, does it work?

Postby stephaniezie » Mon May 28, 2012 1:13 pm

This is something I struggle with because I feel like the TTWD in my relationship is more casual and occasional than anything. I enjoy it, even when I'm not enjoying it, in as much as I need it to exist in some form or another. We aren't very structured, and we're actually pretty vanilla most times. Power struggles do happen, though and that's usually when he'll get out the belt. Sometimes, I don't mind taking it, but then because we have genuine power struggles, I often find it difficult to get out of a combative mindset and into a submissive one, and I often genuinely fight (he's twice my size, soo....yea, that's an exercise in futility). I'm not a totally submissive person, but there is one thing that ties is all together for me and helps me let go of my frustration over being punished. Sex. Generally, if I'm not receptive to a punishment, it has to end in sex. He knows this rule and he knows that if he can't correct my behavior with a punishment alone, I can get angry, and it can spiral out of control until I'm downright nasty. At that point, even if I'm totally unreceptive and and he has to force it on me to start with, sex will calm me down and leave me open to instruction.

Now I understand consent can be a hot-button issue in this type of thing, and all I can say is that in our relationship, it's sometimes dubious at best, but it works for us. Even if I don't always submissive to his attempts to correct me, he has implicit consent to continue to exert dominance over me in one way or another until the rebellious streak is broken and the anger is under control, because it's truly the only way for me to calm down. And sex eases this transition for me from getting from a combative to a submissive mindset.
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